Course Design Approval

SoyKraut · 07-02-2020, 12:27 PM

Drop your course designs in this post for safety review and approval. If we do not have an approved course design AND setup volunteers then we will use the default course layout. Please note that courses will only be able to run in an uphill configuration for safety reasons. (EX: finish on the East end of the main pad.) Also, please consider setting timing boxes close to the ends of the pad. This makes it easier on the timing system.

TheSlowBMW · 07-02-2020, 02:17 PM

We all want as long a course as possible but can't because we have limited space at our site. So we need course designs that loop back around on themselves, and in a way that's reversible for the following day. Usually that means starting with a slalom and focusing around a central cone. But here, I propose a new control mechanism: The Roundabout.

The Good:

This design allows for three possible directions to exit relative to the entry point, and you could even exit back through your entry point to make a U-turn. So in all there's four ways to pass through the roundabout. The direction you turn into the roundabout can also be reversed (e.g. clockwise vs counter-clockwise) so that doubles the possibilities to eight different ways to go through it. Set up in the middle of a course, it effectively gives us a south loop, a north loop, and a combined loop, and we can go through them any number of times, in any order, and in any direction. That should allow us to effectively get a very long course out of a very small area. And as a bonus, the roundabout itself can be pretty challenging as a corner.

The Bad:

Its potentially going to be confusing to remember which direction (clockwise or counter-clockwise) to enter the roundabout and which exit to take. You can take a wrong direction or the wrong exit and end up getting a DNF quite easily, and nobody likes a DNF. The other problem is taking out cones in the roundabout; with the course looping through it so much, the safety workers are either going to have to hustle to get it reset before a driver loops around again, or they're going to have to leave the cones where they are and the driver will be left without reference points or with cones in the way.

Proposed Layout 1: "At the Roundabout, Take the Third Exit"

At The Roundabout, Take the 3rd Exit Potato Quality.jpg

In this scenario, the roundabout functions just like a real life roundabout in which you're always entering in a counter-clockwise direction, and for simplicity's sake are always taking the third exit. That sets us up for the north loop featuring a slalom, the full loop featuring the slalom in the other direction, and an exit. To follow the course, trace the white line, the yellow line, and the green line.

Proposed Layout 2: "The Full Course Loop"

Outer loops Potato Quality.jpg

In this scenario, the roundabout again functions as it would in daily driving, in which you're always entering in a counter-clockwise direction. This time you'll exit to the north and complete the full loop, then re-enter the roundabout, use it as a U-turn to exit to the south and complete the full loop again going the other direction. You'll enter the roundabout one last time and take the third exit through the gates to the finish. This is particularly interesting because the changing radius corner in the south loop should require a very different line in each direction.

Proposed Layout 3: "The Grand Roundabout Course"

[This file is too big?]

This is an example of one of the longer variations you could do. Again we're always entering counter-clockwise like a real-world roundabout, but this time we'll be taking different exits to make sure we hit every short and long loop. First, you'll enter the roundabout and take the short loop on the north. Then you'll exit to the south and take the short loop again. Third you'll enter the roundabout and take the north exit again, this time taking the long loop. Then you'll take a u-turn in the roundabout to exit to the south and take the long loop again before entering the roundabout for a 5th time to exit the course.

SoyKraut · 07-02-2020, 06:48 PM

Thanks for your effort! It's nice having fresh eyes to look at our little site. I like the idea and I think it could work. There are a few tight areas that would need to be opened up in order to prevent a mandatory 1st gear down shift. Namely the North Eastern corner of the roundabout were it interfaces with the Hairpin. Probably wouldn't be a bad thing to open up the roundabout as a whole. Or maybe make the inside of the roundabout a tighter radius to allow for more room. Confusion is a potential issue. But with cones involved it always is.

No doubt people usually prefer longer runs as opposed to shorter ones. The layout you propose definitely could achieve long run times and that is a plus. However it also runs into an issue that we simply cant get around due to the size of our site. That issue we run into is run group time.

Realistically we are pretty much capped around 45 seconds due to only being able to put one car on course at a time. If we have 50 people all running 60 second runs then we would be lucky to get 3 runs before making the group times too long. People love having longer run times. But people also hate working for more than 1:30 per group. It's unfortunate that we can't have 60 second runs and 3 cars on course like we used to be able to do at Stead.

sdpt · 07-02-2020, 08:47 PM

Very interesting Mike. Looks like we could have some fun with this.

sdpt · 07-03-2020, 08:14 AM

This design adds some slalom elements with hopes of keeping speed up. Changing the direction of the course from one day to the next should be very easy to do.

TheSlowBMW · 07-06-2020, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoyKraut

Thanks for your effort! It's nice having fresh eyes to look at our little site. I like the idea and I think it could work. There are a few tight areas that would need to be opened up in order to prevent a mandatory 1st gear down shift. Namely the North Eastern corner of the roundabout were it interfaces with the Hairpin. Probably wouldn't be a bad thing to open up the roundabout as a whole. Or maybe make the inside of the roundabout a tighter radius to allow for more room. Confusion is a potential issue. But with cones involved it always is.

At The Roundabout, Take the 3rd Exit Improved.jpg
Outer Loops Improved.jpg
Dimensions Improved.jpg

Notable improvements - increased the outer diameter of the roundabout, minimized inner diameter of the roundabout; increased the overall diameter of calculus corner; replaced the hairpin with acute corner; added dimensions to aid setup. Approximate path length is 1950 ft for "Take the 3rd Exit" and 2250 for "Outer Loops"

sdpt · 07-21-2020, 07:42 PM

Here is another course design utilizing a roundabout that flows counter clockwise. With this design, you enter the roundabout from the west and take the 3rd exit to the north section of the course. Re-enter the roundabout from the east and continue to the 3rd exit to the south. Complete the outer loop to the north roundabout entrance. Take the 3rd exit to the east and send it across the line.

Course design by Mike Ufford

RENO TRAINING CENTER-03.pdf

TheSlowBMW · 07-22-2020, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sdpt

Course design by Mike Ufford

Attachment 476

Id also like to volunteer to co-chair the event and help with course setup...with the caveat that I've never done such a thing before and would need extensive coaching / mentoring on what exactly that entails.

SoyKraut · 07-27-2020, 05:47 PM

Hey Mike, after looking it over and checking with safety we have decided to go ahead with your course for this upcoming weekend. If you can help set up on Friday let me know. I’ll send you a DM with contact info.

TheSlowBMW · 08-01-2020, 08:36 PM

We had a little bit of confusion at Event 7 on Saturday...so I'm posting the map for Event 8 on Sunday instead of making it a surprise. This is the BRITISH ROUNDABOUT REMIX in which we'll be doing as they do in the UK and going CLOCKWISE on the roundabout as if we were driving on the wrong side of the road like the English do. Study the map. Always take the 3rd exit. And don't get lost!

Another important change: we will be lining up to start at the beginning of the concrete pad instead of a flying start up the ramp on the fresh asphalt. Hopefully it'll keep the times a bit shorter so we can take more runs, and also stop loose asphalt from building up on the track to improve grip. Please GO SLOW as you're approaching the start line from the grid.

UK Roundabout Remix.jpg

sdpt · 08-07-2020, 04:34 PM

Well, since my plans for nationals in Lincoln Nebraska was cancelled, I had time to work on another course map to try for our venue. This course provides quite a few options like the first straight drag launch or the immediate left turn after the timing lights.

sdpt · 08-21-2020, 12:47 PM

Here is the updated course map for Saturday's event. Direction of the course is the same with some eyebrows added.

sdpt · 08-22-2020, 02:00 PM

Thanks to everyone who came out today. Here is the course map for Sunday 8/23.

stevewaclo · 08-22-2020, 03:32 PM

Another challenging course, Steve!

Puts me in mind of Shrek’s large intestine!

Maybe some pointer cones at the first right turn?

TheSlowBMW · 09-07-2020, 12:45 PM

Here I go with another big brain don't-get-lost course design that loops in on itself a few times. Take a look at it and let me know what we need to change for safety reasons (too close to the edge of the pad?) or if its too confusing and needs to be simplified.

Parabolica cones.jpg

Parabolica Day 1.jpg

SoyKraut · 09-07-2020, 08:01 PM

First off, you need to change the name of the course so we don’t have a Ferrari go off and red flag the race.

TheSlowBMW · 09-09-2020, 06:41 PM

That was the inspiration! Looked like an interesting course so I tried to convert the corners into an autocross

The bottom right is trying to mimic Lesmo, the long variable radius is Parabolica, and the esses are Ascari...scaled way down of course.

6a0120a5145462970b013487280527970c-800wi.jpg

sdpt · 09-12-2020, 11:28 AM

Here is another course we could potentially try in the future. Utilizes some of the ramp up to the pad providing some speed to the course. The transition from a Saturday course to Sunday will be very easy as well.

TheSlowBMW · 09-16-2020, 06:33 PM

Updated for safety and more pointers

Mini Monza Saturday.jpg

SoyKraut · 09-30-2020, 04:45 PM

The last course of the season will be the same as the first course of the season.
This way drivers should be able to see how much they have improved. Hope to see you all there!

SoyKraut · 04-22-2021, 04:43 PM

We need course designs for 2021. Please submit your designs here.

teinesina · 05-30-2022, 11:09 AM

Hi - just some thoughts for a potential course. Gates and alleys. I have friday off, and have a young helper and that will be out of school on Friday too, we can come out for course set up on Friday.

07-02-2020, 12:27 PM	#1
SoyKraut Stock Real Name: Ahren Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 88 Car: Class: CS, ASP, FSP, WTF?	Course Design Review/Approval Drop your course designs in this post for safety review and approval. If we do not have an approved course design AND setup volunteers then we will use the default course layout. Please note that courses will only be able to run in an uphill configuration for safety reasons. (EX: finish on the East end of the main pad.) Also, please consider setting timing boxes close to the ends of the pad. This makes it easier on the timing system. Last edited by SoyKraut; 07-02-2020 at 06:00 PM.

07-02-2020, 02:17 PM	#2
TheSlowBMW Novice Real Name: Michael Ufford Join Date: Jul 2020 Posts: 8 Car: Class:	We all want as long a course as possible but can't because we have limited space at our site. So we need course designs that loop back around on themselves, and in a way that's reversible for the following day. Usually that means starting with a slalom and focusing around a central cone. But here, I propose a new control mechanism: The Roundabout. The Good: This design allows for three possible directions to exit relative to the entry point, and you could even exit back through your entry point to make a U-turn. So in all there's four ways to pass through the roundabout. The direction you turn into the roundabout can also be reversed (e.g. clockwise vs counter-clockwise) so that doubles the possibilities to eight different ways to go through it. Set up in the middle of a course, it effectively gives us a south loop, a north loop, and a combined loop, and we can go through them any number of times, in any order, and in any direction. That should allow us to effectively get a very long course out of a very small area. And as a bonus, the roundabout itself can be pretty challenging as a corner. The Bad: Its potentially going to be confusing to remember which direction (clockwise or counter-clockwise) to enter the roundabout and which exit to take. You can take a wrong direction or the wrong exit and end up getting a DNF quite easily, and nobody likes a DNF. The other problem is taking out cones in the roundabout; with the course looping through it so much, the safety workers are either going to have to hustle to get it reset before a driver loops around again, or they're going to have to leave the cones where they are and the driver will be left without reference points or with cones in the way. Proposed Layout 1: "At the Roundabout, Take the Third Exit" At The Roundabout, Take the 3rd Exit Potato Quality.jpg In this scenario, the roundabout functions just like a real life roundabout in which you're always entering in a counter-clockwise direction, and for simplicity's sake are always taking the third exit. That sets us up for the north loop featuring a slalom, the full loop featuring the slalom in the other direction, and an exit. To follow the course, trace the white line, the yellow line, and the green line. Proposed Layout 2: "The Full Course Loop" Outer loops Potato Quality.jpg In this scenario, the roundabout again functions as it would in daily driving, in which you're always entering in a counter-clockwise direction. This time you'll exit to the north and complete the full loop, then re-enter the roundabout, use it as a U-turn to exit to the south and complete the full loop again going the other direction. You'll enter the roundabout one last time and take the third exit through the gates to the finish. This is particularly interesting because the changing radius corner in the south loop should require a very different line in each direction. Proposed Layout 3: "The Grand Roundabout Course" [This file is too big?] This is an example of one of the longer variations you could do. Again we're always entering counter-clockwise like a real-world roundabout, but this time we'll be taking different exits to make sure we hit every short and long loop. First, you'll enter the roundabout and take the short loop on the north. Then you'll exit to the south and take the short loop again. Third you'll enter the roundabout and take the north exit again, this time taking the long loop. Then you'll take a u-turn in the roundabout to exit to the south and take the long loop again before entering the roundabout for a 5th time to exit the course. Last edited by TheSlowBMW; 07-02-2020 at 02:19 PM.

08-22-2020, 03:32 PM	#14
stevewaclo Street Prepared Real Name: Steve Waclo Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Carson City Posts: 235 Car: 1987 Alfa Romeo Quadrifoglio 2018 Class Champion Class: ES	Another challenging course, Steve! Puts me in mind of Shrek’s large intestine! Maybe some pointer cones at the first right turn? __________________ Steve Waclo, ES 2018 Class Champion Last edited by stevewaclo; 08-22-2020 at 03:36 PM. Reason: 2nd thoughts.

09-09-2020, 06:41 PM	#17
TheSlowBMW Novice Real Name: Michael Ufford Join Date: Jul 2020 Posts: 8 Car: Class:	That was the inspiration! Looked like an interesting course so I tried to convert the corners into an autocross The bottom right is trying to mimic Lesmo, the long variable radius is Parabolica, and the esses are Ascari...scaled way down of course. 6a0120a5145462970b013487280527970c-800wi.jpg Last edited by TheSlowBMW; 09-09-2020 at 06:54 PM.

04-22-2021, 04:43 PM	#21
SoyKraut Stock Real Name: Ahren Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 88 Car: Class: CS, ASP, FSP, WTF?	Course designs needed We need course designs for 2021. Please submit your designs here.

07-02-2020, 06:48 PM	#3
SoyKraut Stock Real Name: Ahren Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 88 Car: Class: CS, ASP, FSP, WTF?	Thanks for your effort! It's nice having fresh eyes to look at our little site. I like the idea and I think it could work. There are a few tight areas that would need to be opened up in order to prevent a mandatory 1st gear down shift. Namely the North Eastern corner of the roundabout were it interfaces with the Hairpin. Probably wouldn't be a bad thing to open up the roundabout as a whole. Or maybe make the inside of the roundabout a tighter radius to allow for more room. Confusion is a potential issue. But with cones involved it always is. No doubt people usually prefer longer runs as opposed to shorter ones. The layout you propose definitely could achieve long run times and that is a plus. However it also runs into an issue that we simply cant get around due to the size of our site. That issue we run into is run group time. Realistically we are pretty much capped around 45 seconds due to only being able to put one car on course at a time. If we have 50 people all running 60 second runs then we would be lucky to get 3 runs before making the group times too long. People love having longer run times. But people also hate working for more than 1:30 per group. It's unfortunate that we can't have 60 second runs and 3 cars on course like we used to be able to do at Stead.

07-02-2020, 08:47 PM	#4
sdpt Stock Real Name: Steve Mclaughlin Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Sparks Posts: 50 Car: 2007 Nissan 350z Class: STU	Very interesting Mike. Looks like we could have some fun with this.

07-21-2020, 07:42 PM	#7
sdpt Stock Real Name: Steve Mclaughlin Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Sparks Posts: 50 Car: 2007 Nissan 350z Class: STU	Here is another course design utilizing a roundabout that flows counter clockwise. With this design, you enter the roundabout from the west and take the 3rd exit to the north section of the course. Re-enter the roundabout from the east and continue to the 3rd exit to the south. Complete the outer loop to the north roundabout entrance. Take the 3rd exit to the east and send it across the line. Course design by Mike Ufford RENO TRAINING CENTER-03.pdf

07-27-2020, 05:47 PM	#9
SoyKraut Stock Real Name: Ahren Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 88 Car: Class: CS, ASP, FSP, WTF?	Hey Mike, after looking it over and checking with safety we have decided to go ahead with your course for this upcoming weekend. If you can help set up on Friday let me know. I’ll send you a DM with contact info.

08-01-2020, 08:36 PM	#10
TheSlowBMW Novice Real Name: Michael Ufford Join Date: Jul 2020 Posts: 8 Car: Class:	We had a little bit of confusion at Event 7 on Saturday...so I'm posting the map for Event 8 on Sunday instead of making it a surprise. This is the BRITISH ROUNDABOUT REMIX in which we'll be doing as they do in the UK and going CLOCKWISE on the roundabout as if we were driving on the wrong side of the road like the English do. Study the map. Always take the 3rd exit. And don't get lost! Another important change: we will be lining up to start at the beginning of the concrete pad instead of a flying start up the ramp on the fresh asphalt. Hopefully it'll keep the times a bit shorter so we can take more runs, and also stop loose asphalt from building up on the track to improve grip. Please GO SLOW as you're approaching the start line from the grid. UK Roundabout Remix.jpg

09-07-2020, 12:45 PM	#15
TheSlowBMW Novice Real Name: Michael Ufford Join Date: Jul 2020 Posts: 8 Car: Class:	Here I go with another big brain don't-get-lost course design that loops in on itself a few times. Take a look at it and let me know what we need to change for safety reasons (too close to the edge of the pad?) or if its too confusing and needs to be simplified. Parabolica cones.jpg Parabolica Day 1.jpg

09-07-2020, 08:01 PM	#16
SoyKraut Stock Real Name: Ahren Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 88 Car: Class: CS, ASP, FSP, WTF?	First off, you need to change the name of the course so we don’t have a Ferrari go off and red flag the race.

09-16-2020, 06:33 PM	#19
TheSlowBMW Novice Real Name: Michael Ufford Join Date: Jul 2020 Posts: 8 Car: Class:	Updated for safety and more pointers Mini Monza Saturday.jpg

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